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Tony Campolo - 8/20/2010 12:03:04 PM
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Sonrise
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I remember this guy as a kid, but over the last few years he's rebranded himself a s a radical leftist evangelist, who has a propensity for profanity. He's aligned himself up with some pretty sketchy people and is always claiming that Christians should not get into politics, yet ironically this hasn't prevented him from taking some far left hard line stances. One of his more famous quotes is that "Mixing Christianity with politics is like mixing ice cream and horse manure; the ice cream will be ruined, but the horse manure stays the same." I obviously disagree with him and the fact that he's an advocate of "social justice", but one of my pastors is a big fan of his and has quoted him to me more than once. What are other peoples thoughts on TC?
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RE: Tony Campolo - 8/20/2010 12:06:17 PM
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Eutychus
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My opinion is that the man thinks shocking others with gutter language is the best way to get through them. That, IMO, is the tactic of a junior high school boy rather than a good communicator.
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RE: Tony Campolo - 8/20/2010 12:29:06 PM
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jazzact13
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There was a time I had some respect for him. In the book he co-wrote with McLaren, Adventures in Missing the Point, he was charry in pointing out places were McLaren was edging towards the deep end. Sadly, McLaren has taken a cannon ball off the deep end, and Campolo seems to be edging that way.
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RE: Tony Campolo - 8/20/2010 12:33:23 PM
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CitationSquirrel
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I have not paid any attention to him for many years. I have just read of his slide to the left. I first heard about him about 25 years ago when he made an off-handed remark about people from North Dakota. At the time we were living in North Dakota and my mom hasn’t like him since. When I was in college a few years after that, he spoke at our chapel service. I only remember two things from that. First, when he spoke, he always closed his eyes and turned his head to the left. I just found that odd. Second, I remember the story he told about how he threw a birthday party for a prostitute whom he happened to over hear mention the fact that it was her birthday the next day while he was at a late-night coffee shop.
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RE: Tony Campolo - 8/20/2010 12:51:48 PM
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GroupW
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"Radical leftist" might be a bit of a stretch. He's spoken at my wife's seminary where I've gone to listen. He's not that far left. Personally, I find him rather fascinating. His penchant for profanity is also quite, quite modest. It's not a particular habit that I've observed beyond one frequently used quote he borrows from another source.
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RE: Tony Campolo - 8/20/2010 1:12:39 PM
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A-Mighty-Oak
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He makes people think and challenges people to get out of their comfort zone. There are not too many speakers like that these days.
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RE: Tony Campolo - 8/20/2010 1:30:19 PM
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GroupW
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That's kind of why I like him. I also like the fact that he looks for ways to combine faith and social justice, insisting that the two are not opposed (as many here like to believe) but instead are intimately related and inseparable. Pretty much the whole book of James, but that's just my opinion. Certainly the far left has emphasized social justice at the expense of the Gospel, so it's good to see someone out there who more effectively integrates the two. (He's also hilarious to listen to in person. Tons of wit and humor. Even if you don't like his politics or points of view, I still recommend listening to him. Very interesting dude.)
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RE: Tony Campolo - 8/20/2010 2:26:33 PM
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rawr.ben
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quote:
ORIGINAL: A-Mighty-Oak He makes people think and challenges people to get out of their comfort zone. There are not too many speakers like that these days. Yeah, but he does it with completely errant teachings.
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RE: Tony Campolo - 8/20/2010 2:28:46 PM
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rawr.ben
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quote:
ORIGINAL: GroupW He's spoken at my wife's seminary where I've gone to listen. He's not that far left. He also spoke at my seminary. He said that if you don't believe that the United States is the Babylon of Revelations than you don't know how to read a Bible and aren't saved. Also interesting the way he would say vague things. He said, "I, too, am hot on the homosexual issues!" and people started clapping for him. He failed to mention that he does not think that homosexuality is a sin, nor a result of a choice.
< Message edited by rawr.ben -- 8/20/2010 2:35:16 PM >
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RE: Tony Campolo - 8/20/2010 2:31:34 PM
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rawr.ben
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quote:
ORIGINAL: GroupW That's kind of why I like him. I also like the fact that he looks for ways to combine faith and social justice, insisting that the two are not opposed (as many here like to believe) but instead are intimately related and inseparable. Pretty much the whole book of James, but that's just my opinion. Tony's message of "social justice" comes from his Kingdom Now heresy. He teaches that if we can get this place all fixed up, then that will usher in the End Times.
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RE: Tony Campolo - 8/20/2010 2:45:06 PM
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rawr.ben
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"Beyond these models of reconciliation, a theology of mysticism provides some hope for common ground between Christianity and Islam. Both religions have within their histories examples of ecstatic union with God, which seem at odds with their own spiritual traditions but have much in common with each other." -Tony Campolo (Page 149, Speaking My Mind) "I am saying that there is no salvation apart from Jesus; that's my evangelical mindset. However, I am not convinced that Jesus only lives in Christians" -Tony Campolo (National Liberty Journal, 8/99) "...what can I say to an Islamic brother who has fed the hungry, and clothed the naked? You say, "But he hasn't a personal relationship with Christ." I would argue with that. And I would say from a Christian perspective, in as much as you did it to the least of these you did it unto Christ. You did have a personal relationship with Christ, you just didn't know it." -Tony Campolo EVANGELICALS AND INTERFAITH COOPERATION, An Interview by Shane Claiborne "It seems to me that when we listen to the Muslim mystics as they talk about Jesus and their love for Jesus, I must say, it's a lot closer to New Testament Christianity than a lot of the Christians that I hear. In other words if we are looking for common ground, can we find it in mystical spirituality, even if we cannot theologically agree, Can we pray together in such a way that we connect with a God that transcends our theological differences?" -Tony Campolo EVANGELICALS AND INTERFAITH COOPERATION, An Interview by Shane Claiborne "Jesus is the only Savior, but not everybody who is being saved by Him is aware that He is the one who is doing the saving" -Tony Campolo EP News Service, Oct. 4, 1985 "Today, some of the most spiritual people I know claim to be without religion." -Tony Campolo "Mystical Encounters for Christians" www.beliefnet.com "He saved us in order that He might begin to transform His world into the kind of world that He willed for it to be when He created it. … When Jesus saved us, He saved us to be agents of a great revolution, the end of which will come when the kingdoms of this world will become the Kingdom of our God” -Tony Campolo "It's Friday but Sundays Coming", page 106 "Our call is to be God’s agents, to rescue not only the human race but the whole of creation.” -Tony Campolo TEAR TIMES, “Why care for creation?” 1992 "...Isn’t God’s message to sinful humanity that He sees in each of us a divine nature of such worth that He sacrificed His own Son so that our divine potentialities might be realized? ... The hymn writer who taught us to sing “Amazing Grace” was all too ready to call himself a “wretch” ... Forgetting our divinity and over-identifying with our [Freudian] anal humanity... Erich Fromm, one of the most popular psychoanalysts of our time, recognized the diabolical social consequences that can come about when a person loses sight of his/her own divinity ...” -Tony Campolo "Partly Right" 1995 “What I am trying to say is that Jesus who incarnated God 2,000 years ago is mystically present and waiting to be discovered in EVERY person you and I encounter” -Tony Campolo "A Reasonable Faith" 1983 page 171 “I do not mean that others represent Jesus for us. I mean that Jesus actually is present in each other person." -Tony Campolo "A Reasonable Faith" 1983 page 192 “There is a feminine side of God. I always knew this ... It is this feminine side of God I find in Jesus that makes me want to sing duets with Him ... Not only do I love the feminine is Jesus, but the more I know Jesus, the more I realize that Jesus loves the feminine in me. Until I accept the feminine in my humanness, there will be a part of me that cannot receive the Lord's love. ... There is that feminine side of me that must be recovered and strengthened if I am to be like Christ ... And until I feel the feminine in Jesus, there is a part of Him which I cannot identify.” -Tony Campolo "Carpe Diem: Seize the Day", 1994, pages 85-88 "going to heaven is like going to Philadelphia....There are many ways....It doesn't make any difference how we go there. We all end up in the same place." -Tony Campolo "Carpe Diem: Seize the Day", 1994, pages 85-88 "When in fact we live in a society that makes life hell for gays and lesbians, this community has got to stand up and say, 'We're on your side as you struggle for dignity,' and, 'Yes, we will defy anybody who says otherwise, even if we have to go to Disneyland to prove it.'" -Tony Campolo "Campolo: Opposition to women preachers evidence of demonic influence" Jun 27, 2003, By Gregory Tomlin,Baptist Press "On the other hand, we are hard-pressed to find any biblical basis for condemning deep love commitments between homosexual Christians, as long as those commitments are not expressed in sexual intercourse." -Tony Campolo "20 Hot Potatoes Christians Are Afraid To Touch", page 117 "I'm not convinced that Jesus only lives in Christians." -Tony Campolo Charlie Rose show on January 24, 1997 Campolo has said, “If I am found to be in error, I’m ready either to recant or to say that I don’t belong in the evangelical tradition anymore.” I'll assume your resignation letter is in the mail?
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RE: Tony Campolo - 8/20/2010 5:40:37 PM
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Sonrise
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quote:
ORIGINAL: rawr.ben quote:
ORIGINAL: GroupW He's spoken at my wife's seminary where I've gone to listen. He's not that far left. He also spoke at my seminary. He said that if you don't believe that the United States is the Babylon of Revelations than you don't know how to read a Bible and aren't saved. Also interesting the way he would say vague things. He said, "I, too, am hot on the homosexual issues!" and people started clapping for him. He failed to mention that he does not think that homosexuality is a sin, nor a result of a choice. Do you have a link for this, by any chance?
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RE: Tony Campolo - 8/20/2010 5:46:16 PM
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Sonrise
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quote:
ORIGINAL: rawr.ben "Beyond these models of reconciliation, a theology of mysticism provides some hope for common ground between Christianity and Islam. Both religions have within their histories examples of ecstatic union with God, which seem at odds with their own spiritual traditions but have much in common with each other." -Tony Campolo (Page 149, Speaking My Mind) "I am saying that there is no salvation apart from Jesus; that's my evangelical mindset. However, I am not convinced that Jesus only lives in Christians" -Tony Campolo (National Liberty Journal, 8/99) "...what can I say to an Islamic brother who has fed the hungry, and clothed the naked? You say, "But he hasn't a personal relationship with Christ." I would argue with that. And I would say from a Christian perspective, in as much as you did it to the least of these you did it unto Christ. You did have a personal relationship with Christ, you just didn't know it." -Tony Campolo EVANGELICALS AND INTERFAITH COOPERATION, An Interview by Shane Claiborne "It seems to me that when we listen to the Muslim mystics as they talk about Jesus and their love for Jesus, I must say, it's a lot closer to New Testament Christianity than a lot of the Christians that I hear. In other words if we are looking for common ground, can we find it in mystical spirituality, even if we cannot theologically agree, Can we pray together in such a way that we connect with a God that transcends our theological differences?" -Tony Campolo EVANGELICALS AND INTERFAITH COOPERATION, An Interview by Shane Claiborne "Jesus is the only Savior, but not everybody who is being saved by Him is aware that He is the one who is doing the saving" -Tony Campolo EP News Service, Oct. 4, 1985 "Today, some of the most spiritual people I know claim to be without religion." -Tony Campolo "Mystical Encounters for Christians" www.beliefnet.com "He saved us in order that He might begin to transform His world into the kind of world that He willed for it to be when He created it. … When Jesus saved us, He saved us to be agents of a great revolution, the end of which will come when the kingdoms of this world will become the Kingdom of our God” -Tony Campolo "It's Friday but Sundays Coming", page 106 "Our call is to be God’s agents, to rescue not only the human race but the whole of creation.” -Tony Campolo TEAR TIMES, “Why care for creation?” 1992 "...Isn’t God’s message to sinful humanity that He sees in each of us a divine nature of such worth that He sacrificed His own Son so that our divine potentialities might be realized? ... The hymn writer who taught us to sing “Amazing Grace” was all too ready to call himself a “wretch” ... Forgetting our divinity and over-identifying with our [Freudian] anal humanity... Erich Fromm, one of the most popular psychoanalysts of our time, recognized the diabolical social consequences that can come about when a person loses sight of his/her own divinity ...” -Tony Campolo "Partly Right" 1995 “What I am trying to say is that Jesus who incarnated God 2,000 years ago is mystically present and waiting to be discovered in EVERY person you and I encounter” -Tony Campolo "A Reasonable Faith" 1983 page 171 “I do not mean that others represent Jesus for us. I mean that Jesus actually is present in each other person." -Tony Campolo "A Reasonable Faith" 1983 page 192 “There is a feminine side of God. I always knew this ... It is this feminine side of God I find in Jesus that makes me want to sing duets with Him ... Not only do I love the feminine is Jesus, but the more I know Jesus, the more I realize that Jesus loves the feminine in me. Until I accept the feminine in my humanness, there will be a part of me that cannot receive the Lord's love. ... There is that feminine side of me that must be recovered and strengthened if I am to be like Christ ... And until I feel the feminine in Jesus, there is a part of Him which I cannot identify.” -Tony Campolo "Carpe Diem: Seize the Day", 1994, pages 85-88 "going to heaven is like going to Philadelphia....There are many ways....It doesn't make any difference how we go there. We all end up in the same place." -Tony Campolo "Carpe Diem: Seize the Day", 1994, pages 85-88 "When in fact we live in a society that makes life hell for gays and lesbians, this community has got to stand up and say, 'We're on your side as you struggle for dignity,' and, 'Yes, we will defy anybody who says otherwise, even if we have to go to Disneyland to prove it.'" -Tony Campolo "Campolo: Opposition to women preachers evidence of demonic influence" Jun 27, 2003, By Gregory Tomlin,Baptist Press "On the other hand, we are hard-pressed to find any biblical basis for condemning deep love commitments between homosexual Christians, as long as those commitments are not expressed in sexual intercourse." -Tony Campolo "20 Hot Potatoes Christians Are Afraid To Touch", page 117 "I'm not convinced that Jesus only lives in Christians." -Tony Campolo Charlie Rose show on January 24, 1997 Campolo has said, “If I am found to be in error, I’m ready either to recant or to say that I don’t belong in the evangelical tradition anymore.” I'll assume your resignation letter is in the mail? Most of these quotes are jaw dropping, but what do you disagree with about the gay ones? If two people truly love one another but are not lustful or sexual, how is that a sin?
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RE: Tony Campolo - 8/20/2010 11:32:33 PM
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rawr.ben
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Sonrise Most of these quotes are jaw dropping, but what do you disagree with about the gay ones? If two people truly love one another but are not lustful or sexual, how is that a sin? Perhaps a discussion for another thread. It's a good question though.
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RE: Tony Campolo - 8/20/2010 11:36:13 PM
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rawr.ben
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Sonrise quote:
ORIGINAL: rawr.ben quote:
ORIGINAL: GroupW He's spoken at my wife's seminary where I've gone to listen. He's not that far left. He also spoke at my seminary. He said that if you don't believe that the United States is the Babylon of Revelations than you don't know how to read a Bible and aren't saved. Also interesting the way he would say vague things. He said, "I, too, am hot on the homosexual issues!" and people started clapping for him. He failed to mention that he does not think that homosexuality is a sin, nor a result of a choice. Do you have a link for this, by any chance? I guess, more specifically, his wife, Peggy, is a gay-rights activist, and he willingly sits by her side at rallies and events. Here is one link about it: http://www.wfn.org/2010/07/msg00078.html
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RE: Tony Campolo - 8/20/2010 11:50:33 PM
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GroupW
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Based on things I've read, he and his wife disagree on that issue. He stands by her despite that, which is appropriate.
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RE: Tony Campolo - 8/21/2010 1:33:17 AM
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Sonrise
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quote:
ORIGINAL: rawr.ben quote:
ORIGINAL: Sonrise quote:
ORIGINAL: rawr.ben quote:
ORIGINAL: GroupW He's spoken at my wife's seminary where I've gone to listen. He's not that far left. He also spoke at my seminary. He said that if you don't believe that the United States is the Babylon of Revelations than you don't know how to read a Bible and aren't saved. Also interesting the way he would say vague things. He said, "I, too, am hot on the homosexual issues!" and people started clapping for him. He failed to mention that he does not think that homosexuality is a sin, nor a result of a choice. Do you have a link for this, by any chance? I guess, more specifically, his wife, Peggy, is a gay-rights activist, and he willingly sits by her side at rallies and events. Here is one link about it: http://www.wfn.org/2010/07/msg00078.html Interesting article, sounds like compromise has crept in. On a side note, this quote in the article struck me funny : Tony, who was present to hear her address, is a well-known evangelical preacher whose work focuses on simple living and ending global poverty. Didn't Jesus say that the poor will always be amongst us? I'm not saying we shouldn't help the poor, we're in fact commanded to, but to have a goal to end something that Jesus said will always be here seems futile.
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RE: Tony Campolo - 8/21/2010 8:44:57 AM
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rawr.ben
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Sonrise Interesting article, sounds like compromise has crept in. On a side note, this quote in the article struck me funny : Tony, who was present to hear her address, is a well-known evangelical preacher whose work focuses on simple living and ending global poverty. Didn't Jesus say that the poor will always be amongst us? I'm not saying we shouldn't help the poor, we're in fact commanded to, but to have a goal to end something that Jesus said will always be here seems futile. That is also linked to his Kingdom Now heretical belief. That it is our duty, as Christians, to create "heaven on earth" since God has lost control of the earth to Satan. We are filled with the Holy Spirit for the sake of bringing out social change and reclaiming all authority. Secular society can never succeed, so separation of church and state is opposed. Once we can purge the earth of all evil ourselves, then, and only then, will the Second Coming occur. Essential, they are the "Joel's Army" folks, and also linked to Dominionists.
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RE: Tony Campolo - 8/25/2010 4:03:31 PM
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Sonrise
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quote:
ORIGINAL: GroupW Based on things I've read, he and his wife disagree on that issue. He stands by her despite that, which is appropriate. Or one could argue that they're unequally yoked since she's taken a stance in favor of something that God clearly calls unrepentant sin. That's a tough call.
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RE: Tony Campolo - 8/26/2010 12:46:49 PM
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Charis2U
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I honestly haven't kept up with TC in over a decade I first heard of him on Focus on the Family when "Its Friday but Sunday's Coming" was played about 15 years ago on there. My in laws also had a video of him, and he seemed solid back then. The only thing before this thread I had heard was he had become a founder of the group Sojourners and the "Red Letter Christians" with Shane Claiborne and others. Also, Palmer Theological Seminary, where TC graduated and teaches at, from what I've read is a liberal school.
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RE: Tony Campolo - 8/29/2010 10:41:20 PM
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Sonrise
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quote:
ORIGINAL: bapti_costal I honestly haven't kept up with TC in over a decade I first heard of him on Focus on the Family when "Its Friday but Sunday's Coming" was played about 15 years ago on there. My in laws also had a video of him, and he seemed solid back then. The only thing before this thread I had heard was he had become a founder of the group Sojourners and the "Red Letter Christians" with Shane Claiborne and others. Also, Palmer Theological Seminary, where TC graduated and teaches at, from what I've read is a liberal school. Is this Jim Wallis' group? if so TC has gone really radically to the left, Wallis is a Marxist. I remember Tony Campolo when I was a kid back in the mid 80's, what happened to this dude?
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RE: Tony Campolo - 8/30/2010 12:15:30 AM
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Charis2U
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Sonrise quote:
ORIGINAL: bapti_costal I honestly haven't kept up with TC in over a decade I first heard of him on Focus on the Family when "Its Friday but Sunday's Coming" was played about 15 years ago on there. My in laws also had a video of him, and he seemed solid back then. The only thing before this thread I had heard was he had become a founder of the group Sojourners and the "Red Letter Christians" with Shane Claiborne and others. Also, Palmer Theological Seminary, where TC graduated and teaches at, from what I've read is a liberal school. Is this Jim Wallis' group? if so TC has gone really radically to the left, Wallis is a Marxist. I remember Tony Campolo when I was a kid back in the mid 80's, what happened to this dude? Yea it is Wallis' group. As for what happened to TC. Good question. Its funny that my old church thought I was becoming liberal, when the pastor and his wife have been reading books by members of that group.
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RE: Tony Campolo - 9/4/2010 10:11:54 AM
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IE_2009
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I appreciate that he has challenged my thinking in a couple of areas. Sometimes we need that badly - as many are prone to just believe what we've been told (by our pastors, other Christians, etc). But, that doesn't mean that I agree with him on all of his conclusions.
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RE: Tony Campolo - 9/8/2010 12:54:24 AM
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klaymaster7
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quote:
ORIGINAL: IE_2009 I appreciate that he has challenged my thinking in a couple of areas. Sometimes we need that badly - as many are prone to just believe what we've been told (by our pastors, other Christians, etc). But, that doesn't mean that I agree with him on all of his conclusions. You've kind of contradicted yourself here. You disagree with people being told what to believe by their pastors and other Christians yet you're ok with Tony Campolo telling you what to believe? I'm not sure why we need people to change our thinking either. I mean, why don't we just read the bible? It's the infallible Word of God and it never changes. It always stays the same and is never out-dated. I think we can get really caught up in all this other STUFF and we forget that all we need is God's Word.
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RE: Tony Campolo - 9/8/2010 9:27:51 AM
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Eutychus
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quote:
ORIGINAL: klaymaster7 quote:
ORIGINAL: IE_2009 I appreciate that he has challenged my thinking in a couple of areas. Sometimes we need that badly - as many are prone to just believe what we've been told (by our pastors, other Christians, etc). But, that doesn't mean that I agree with him on all of his conclusions. You've kind of contradicted yourself here. You disagree with people being told what to believe by their pastors and other Christians yet you're ok with Tony Campolo telling you what to believe? I'm not sure why we need people to change our thinking either. I mean, why don't we just read the bible? It's the infallible Word of God and it never changes. It always stays the same and is never out-dated. I think we can get really caught up in all this other STUFF and we forget that all we need is God's Word. Hi klaymaster7 and welcome to the forum. While I have serious reservations about Tony Campolo, I have to disagree with you that we can develop sound theology in isolation. Paul writes that we are parts of the greater body of Christ, with differing gifts that make up the whole. To borrow from his analogy, if we become an isolated eye, we also become ineffective and limited. We need our fellow believers to gently sound the alarm when we drift off track due to a misunderstanding about the Bible. The Holy Spirit is a perfect transmitter of Truth, but none of us are perfect receivers and, therefore, need each other to receive most ofg His instruction.
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